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representatives of the taliban leadership in germany and qatar over 2010 through 2012 and which of course al qaeda and the taliban's relationships with a central question. and i could say the taliban never questioned whether al qaeda had carried out 9/11 or whether 9/11 was the recent united date fate of afghanistan. they said they are punishing us for some and we did do. it was quite a different argument. you can argue whether that's an active statement on their part or not. but they didn't contest the reality of what had happened. iraq is a different question which had nothing to do with 9/11. we are not going to talk about that here tonight however. >> i hope the parallel a feudal europe isn't that far-fetched, but inspiration for a lot of my theoretical argumentation. and this book on the scholar who influenced my work as well as barney's work with the head of the sociology department here at columbia for many years. charles tilly who described across as a stable nation in europe as many as nine did many, many times, which involved engagement on the part of strongmen at different hour
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